Hardy is a hard time...
Le mercredi, juillet 30 2008, 02:06 ::
I'm tired of Hardy. Tired of the bugs, tired of this Operating System. Yes, for the first time, I really regret to use Ubuntu.
Network-manager need 10 times more Wifi power to detect a Wifi and asks you your WEP key again and again, at least, when it works. But it's not a real problem because, anyway, Firefox and Epiphany are crashing on nearly half of the pages you browse daily. And, as usual, Evolution is frozen and requires a kill. So, why would you want to use a network ?
Sound is shaggy so you fallback on VLC but, in Hardy, even VLC crashes and/or mess up your video. Want to cry and talk with someone ? Launch the Psi Jabber client and try to register a Jabber account. Just try. You believe you can only work ? At least if you don't need too much SMB shares on your desktop. Even using Nautilus is now impossible in spatial mode ! And I hope you don't have some disabilities.
Just before the Hardy release, I decided to change my good old Debian server for an Ubuntu one. In order to be 100% Ubuntu, you know. Sigh... Since I upgraded to Hardy, suphp isn't working anymore. I spent countless hours on it but, no matter what, it doesn't work. The exact same files work fine under Debian with exactly the same configuration. In Hardy, well, if you have mod_php, suphp will be ignored. It you don't, suphp will simply fail with an Error 500 and a log full of "SecurityException in Application.cpp:440: Handler not found in configuration, Caused by KeyNotFoundException in Configuration.cpp:234: Handler "application/x-httpd-php" not found, Premature end of script headers". In normal times, I would say that I'm missing something, that I did a mistake. But I do not trust my system anymore. Why spending tireless night only to discover that, oops, this is a bug in some package because it was patched for some reason ? All my work is stalled like it never was. I tried to report as many bug as I can but 99% are already reported and, honnestly, in Hardy it would be a full-time job to just report all the bugs I see everyday.
In the past years, I've converted countless people to Ubuntu. Nearly all of them are the most basic computer users you could imagine. I converted them because Windows was too complicated for them. They were all happy. All of them were completely astonished. Until they upgraded to Hardy.
Today, each time I see one of those people, they talk to me about their computer problem. I wish we could sometime talk about the weather :
- Hello, I have a problem on my comp...
Then, they see the sadness in my eyes. I don't move a finger but they understand immediatly. Slowly, like an old tired man, I reply :
- I know...
Just wait until october...
PS : I know that some answers will be "report the bugs". I did, but reporting doesn't solve. Some will say "send your patches". I did. Well, nearly nothing but I believe that all the people who don't contribute can also have a good Ubuntu experience. The goal is to have users. Last but not least; some will say that they don't experience all those bugs. I did. Some of my friends are even less lucky than me. Some have a few bugs only. But we all agree that we have ten times more problem than in Gutsy. I do not need to be convinced. I love Ubuntu and I will continue to love it because I'm sure that Hardy is an accident. Only an accident and that we, the community, will learn from this big mistake.
Commentaires
I feel your pain. There is a bug where if you are using wabi and you do the regular updates then it won't boot anymore. Reported a bug but nobody cares...
At least xp boots!
Well, at least you got brought back down to reality that nothing is perfect.
Hope some things clear up for you and you'll go on!
I understand your frustration totally. In my opinion, 8.04 was not ready when it was released. There are too many feature regressions, too many things wrong.
I'm still using Ubuntu, but I'm going to wait a long time before upgrading to 8.10.
dan
I love Hardy and currently hae no problems no bugs with it exept firefox and evolution crashing at first but now everything is ok: Firefox, Pidgin, Ooo, Evolution, Vlc, Rythmbox, Compiz-fusion .......
I agree, evolutioj in hardy is sooooo bugy....
And right now I'm typing this from my live cd because my grub got broken, and my filesystem "damaged"....
J'aurais aimé pouvoir dire que c'était ton second mauvais article (après la Belgique :P ) ...
mais non.
:(
Bon article. Chez moi, Firefox crache tout le temps, mes touches F1-F10 ne fonctionnent vraiement pas souvent ...
Je suis content d'apprendre que ce ne sont pas juste moi et mes amis qui avons des problèmes : je commençais à me sentir coupable ...
Vivement avril ...
No one is forcing you to use Ubuntu. If you like it use it, if you don't move on. Use something else and stop whining. Life is not perfect bunkie.
Ubuntu's release circle is completely absurd and produces bad distros.
That is bad for Ubuntu and for Linux too.
After try several Ubuntu releases, I'm sticking with Debian :)
I totally agree with that.
I just can add this:
why the hell did they switched the driver for the intel pro wireless (centrino) from ipw3945 to iwl3945 that totally sucks?
now i have to boot twice to simply connect to a wireless, my led doesnt work anymore and a reconnection fails always.
I have used hardy on several old and new computers with very little trouble, laptop included, I have a Broadcom wireless card in an old Dell laptop that is working better than when windows was on it, so different computers different people different experiences, this criticism of Ubuntu Hardy is unfair and not very useful, I have only experienced minor bugs which is common to all operating systems Windows,(which you should start using exclusively) Debian,Mac OS they all have bloody bugs, why the hell do you need to perpetrate such nonsense here? Would serve you better to file bug reports with launchpad. SHEESH!!!
I share your pain with hardy. Network manager not being able to save my wep key drives me nuts. I reported the bug (bugs.edge.launchpad.net/u... but nobody seems to care.
The problem with Dasher shows that we need a Review section of Launchpad, so each release can have a checklist of packages to test for bugs. Ubuntu would only be allowed to release if Every Single Thing with a change was looked at at least once by an end user. The fact that broken applications slip through is just abysmal.
I bumped into a similar issue, if I recall correctly with Lyx.
NM 0.7 is just as weird about remembering my network keys right now, if not weirder. Currently have 8 duplicate entries for my wireless network, and (at random!) when I try to reconnect it sometimes wants my password again, creating another new entry.
I agree that Hardy is not up to scratch. Perhaps that sounds harsh but in a sense it's a testament to the level of polish I'm used to in a Ubuntu distribution.
I remember at the time Mark Shuttleworth hailed the "on schedule" release of 8.04 as a triumph and that his was somehow a path all distros should aim for (and jointly).
With hindsight I wonder whether the decision to hit the target data in fact caused a lack of polish which harms Mark's argument rather than helps it.
In many ways Hardy seems more like an Edgy release.
Ben chez moi ça marche, et j'utilise pas PSI mais PIDGIN, pas Evolution (qui a toujours été très très nul) mais thunderbird.
Hé hé. the firts think I do with my debian sid is 'apt-get remove network-manager' ... I really don't like it!
I'm really happy with debian ... ho! You no, sorry ;-)
Some things I hate about Hardy, everything else I love:
- Firefox crashing with Flash (I know, Flash is proprietary, and FF3 has issues, but this initially had to do with pulseaudio until I switched all of my users' audio setups to ALSA), it's getting better but there's still crashes!
- Pulseaudio, don't get me started on how many crashes I've experienced. Pulseaudio is garbage, screw it, I piss on it. Switched all of my users to ALSA, but pulseaudio crap is still loaded, rubbish!
- Having to Google on how to set VLC to default DVD loading on insertion, had to manually change a file and I shouldn't have had to do this at all, I should be able to do this with one click in a GUI, not in some bastard text file!
- VLC had trouble playing DVDs on insertion problem #2: I had to Google and found I had to change the shortcut properties command field to vlc %m, which fixed the problem along with the other solution going hand in hand with this one. I shouldn't have to do this!
- Compiz auto loading by default, screw that, I want an initial configuration choice and have it saved in preferences, not on by default!
There were a couple of other issues but I've forgotten. I love Ubuntu, but this release had a few bumps. If the next release has more of the same, I'll install Debian on a separate box and draw a comparison between the two. I can't find any real faults here, though, I paid nothing for it and the community is far above any other Linux community.
Ubuntu, I still love you! (kisses to Ubuntu developers)
I use KDE4 (now 4.1) on a Kubuntu system and it runs excellent for me. Perhaps a vanilla Kubuntu install with KDE4.1 packages is worth is exploring.
Well, I feel sorry for you, but besides some minor conflicts I have been overall more satisfied with Hardy than with Gutsy.
Those minor conflicts are:
- Hardy uses an old, bugged bluez-utils. I had to replace it with the latest Sid build to get most of my Bluetooth functionality working (I can use Amora again), but at least it hasn't bothered me anymore.
- Flash crashing on Firefox. No, it doesn't crash Firefox, it simply leaves a gray box where the flash embed should be, and only restarting firefox a couple times makes it work again. For some reason this hasn't happened again after 8.04.1, but it was very irritating.
- Glipper crashes everytime the computer boots. Bah, whatever, replaced it with Parcellite. I am never looking back.
I have intel wireles and graphics on my laptop. I'm quite skeptical about Ubuntu for the reasons above, but actually I find Hardy really good; I've been using it ever day for six weeks every day for work and at home; it works for all the wireless networks I connect to, and Evolution, Firefox and VirtualBox are really stable for me (although only with 8.04.1 upgrades in the case of Evolution). On the other hand, I also use Debian, and Lenny with a 2.6.26 kernel and a high-quality approach to gnome (Nautilus 2.22 is still not trusted by Debian) means Debian Lenny will be a really good option for those having problems with Ubuntu.
It was a clean install on a new Toshiba notebook.
Just wanted to say that i realize people do have problems with Hardy esp sound , wireless , and internet (firefox) but also wanted to mention for some (maybe most) it works good, i'm sorry. we all await intrepid...
This is why *testing* software is, in fact, not supposed to be released to the public at large? If you break it, you get to keep the pieces?
The price of the bleeding edge is blood. If Ubuntu wants to live on the bleeding edge, blood they will extract.
<insert mandatory mumble about how ubuntu sucks and is dangerous software here, even though it's -- for once -- not entirely relevant :-)>
Désolé d'être rabât-joie mais... Ça donne quoi tout ça en français ?
Malheureusement je suis assez d'accord avec toi, autant FF ne crash pas chez moi, et je n'utilise pas Evolution, mais les partages sont devenu une calamité telle qu'ils sont dans cette 8.04, et le Wifi... pff j'en parle même plus j'ai toujours été dessus par le Wifi sous Ubuntu, mais là O_O
J'ai pourtant attendu la 8.04.1 pour y passer vu les échos qu'il y avait... beh assez deçu tout de même. Un peaufinage de deux mois de plus n'aurait pas été du luxe.
Sorry to hear about your problems. It's very sad that Canonical have let down their users like this.
I have a feeling that a large number of the bugs are due to the ultimate suckage that is PulseAudio.
Good luck.
Yet another victim of the Ubuntu hype machine.
Fortunately, Ubuntu is not the only GNU/Linux distro in town.
For over a year I have been running PCLinuxOS on a Vaio without nearly a single flaw to report.
Unlike Ubuntu, PCLOS follows a rolling release approach, which permits us to have a state of the art OS without the hassle of "upgrading".
The major downside? No cute cases to ship the CD's in, as far as i know :)
Folks have to realize once and for all that Ubuntu is a marketing operation, charity style, not a distribution. It lives off Debian and whatever is brought in is usually buggier.
Chez moi, Hardy marche très correctement, si ce n'est que j'ai du désactiver Pulseaudio pour améliorer la stabilité de Firefox lors de lectures de vidéos en flash...
I agree, the Flash crash is really pissing me off too.
That's very frustrating as it appears to be fixed in Intrepid : bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu...
Don't know why they are so slow to backport the fix to Hardy...
The main reason I finally made the total switch from ubuntu to debian was 8.04. i had been using it on my media/server pc. but now I use a mixed testing/unstable on my thinkpad r61 with nvidia graphics. I was prepared for breakage, haven't seen any yet. can't say that about my ubuntu machines with 8.04. especialy FF and banshee/exaile.
I am not sure if you have considered this possibility. I was having too many crashes and rhythmbox used to puase for 1-2 seconds automatically. On a hunch I decided to check my RAM modules. One of them is gone. Either it was a module problem or RAM slot problem. But I don't have any crashes now.
All I can say is, Ubuntu 8.04 works pretty well for me. I use it every day.
My experience with Hardy is quite ok, compared to gutsy it is a delight even. In gutsy i had several evolution crashes a day. I didn't have that for the last month with hardy.
Also i feel hardy is much faster.
However I have to note i only use a limited feature set of Ubuntu, but no problems at all.
I have to say Flash videos on FF3 drive me crazy!
But except that, I didn't have that much troubles... but I use my computer for very basic operations (a little bit of programming, video, Web...).
I didn't know Hardy was such a pain for so many users!
Hopefully the next release will be better...
Ploum, did you try to contact Mark Shuttleworth or other people from the official Ubuntu team? I'm asking, cause the latest news I read from Mark was he wanted a very eye-candy desktop... seems he doesn't care about WiFi! :)
Tout fonctionne chez moi, aucun problème à signaler. Que vous soyez déçu est une chose mais n'en dégouttez pas les débutants s'il vous plaît. Ayez au moins, dans ce cas, la présence d'esprit de proposer des alternatives.
I quite agree, I am completely unable do make ethernet work. I didn't even try the wifi ;-)
I am thinking of installing back gutsy, or maybe switch to another distro.
I have Ubuntu 8.04 running on exotic hardware, NO problems. Maybe you're just too naab :') get windows and have fun (with bugs).
You should try MEPIS (mepis.org) - you'll really enjoy Linux!
Works for me ! It'll work for you eventually.
("Works for me ! is a Linux trademark")
("eventually" is a linux trademark)
I have been using Ubuntu since 5.10 and have upgraded to each new version without any hitches. I totally changed all the components in my PC a few weeks back and did a clean install of the 64bit 8.04.1 and I have no issues, well strictly not true I did have a right merry dance with xorg not detecting the correct screen resolution due to my monitor. But apart from that no issues.
I don't trust wireless full stop and I have always had grief with it windows and Linux and yes before all the PCLOS crowd start crowing, PCLOS 2007 was the worst offender. On the subject of PCLOS, why oh why is the Gnome version still using 2.21?
I am sorry to hear that people are having issues with Ubuntu, but if you are not happy with it switch. That is the beauty of Linux, we have a choice, granted there is a lot of choice, but at least we have the choice, eh! Imagine if we were stuck with just the one version of Linux as they do with Windows... doesn't bear thinking about.
"Parents : talk to your kids about linux... before somebody else does" :D (xkcd.com/456/)
That's why I use Arch Linux..switched from gutsy and I never regretted it. Everything works, period.
That said, my father's laptop runs ok with Hardy, but then it was a direct upgrade from Gutsy, and I doubt that pulseaudio was enabled. Lucky me.
une version française serait la bienvenue pour éviter cette regrettable suppression . . . de ce qui fâche certaines autruches
forum.planet-libre.org/vi...
I have no problems with hardy. And actually I dont know any person who has such problems with hardy,
It sounds more like hardware problems if you ask me :)
I can´t imagine that the complete ubuntu software stack is so buggy.
Tengo tres máquinas con Hardy- Las tres funcionan casi perfectamente. Lo único es que xorg descontinuó la posibilidad de conectar un proyector LCD por la edad del driver radeon en la lap-top. Asi es la vida.
In fact Ubuntu means "you bug too".. It's not a new thing. For those reasons i will never use Ubuntu. Debian is most people ready. I ask myself why many people see only the facade and not the interior...
De mon côté, tout fonctionne... Ou pas.
Pas de problème spécifique avec firefox... Par contre :
- Je suis obligé de démarrer sur l'avant-dernier kernel installé. En effet, le tout dernier ne démarre tout simplement pas. Semble même pas dépasser grub...
- Mon graveur ne grave plus depuis que je suis passé à Hardy. Chier.
- La lecture de vidéo est une plaie, que ce soit avec vlc ou le lecteur par défaut (dont j'ai oublié le nome)
Bref, tout aussi déçu.
Le pire dans tout ça, c'est que je m'investis pas pour reporter un seul problème...
Lunix sucked in whatever form.. gave up on it some time ago
welcome to the real world
debian.org/
Etrange, j'ai upgradé de gutsy à hardy sans problème (sauf les améliorations visuelles mais je met ça sur le compte du pilote vidéo).
FF ne me pose aucun soucis, malgré quelques plugins. Par contre j'ai dû réinstaller mon profile FF, qui semblait en rade totale. Perso venant de Mandriva j'ai trouvé Ubuntu bien mieux faite... mais je vais l'installer ici et ailleurs avant de le conseiller).
Very odd, I've been running the KDE versions of Ubuntu for a long while now and I've not run into the issues you're talking about with Hardy. Currently using it on at 2 desktops and a laptop (all Intel graphics) and it works like a charm.
Tiens... Je suis sous kubuntu depuis deux ans... Je passe à la version suivate 4 à 8 semaines après sa sortie.
- Un laptop AMD64, sur lequel j'ai dû désactiver pulseaudio sinon silence. Sinon, c'est toujours aussi stable, cool etc. En plus, j'ai désormais du flash dans certains cas.
- sur le fixe (un AMD Sempron 3000, pas récent certes), j'ai enfin de vraies possibilités d'utiliser ma carte graphique AGP (deux écrans, etc.).
I've moved all my machines from hardy to opensuse11 or Mandriva. I prefer .deb vs rpm's so you can tell my experience with hardy has been unpleasant. I've rarely had flawless installs with ubuntu especially with regard to ati/nvidia drivers, non-working virtual terminals and other niggles. The quality control on the other distros seems far more rigid. As a LTS release, its actually embarassing. I hope the 8.04.1 ISO is better quality then the initial release. I will probably still go back to using a debian based system if I find that Mint or Mepis works better.
Stuff like this is why I've given up on linux on my laptop. Constant bugs, crashes and just general weirdness. Especially with ubuntu; I've tried each version since hoary and something different breaks with each release.
"I love Ubuntu and I will continue to love it because I'm sure that Hardy is an accident. Only an accident and that we, the community, will learn from this big mistake." -- OP
I have to say I feel your pain. I am having issues as well with Hardy. I suspect the 64bit version is even more problematic. Half the time the CD is not recognized, NetworkManager is a disaster, etc, etc,
To those who say stop whining. Well its actually the other way around. Hardy is an LTS release so it should be rock solid on 90% of all platforms. Canonical complains that they don't seem to be getting the take rate they should be getting in the server market. Well Duh! If on a test install a hosting company has to have a tech do a 'tweak the magic dance' to get it to work; the manager is going to hand the tech the same Centos5 OS they have been using since January. Its that simple.
Hardy is NOT ready for prime time.
Fais un journal pour vendredi et poste le sur Linuxfr.org...
I formatted my last ubuntu install 3 days ago. I experienced all the same issues and more. I had two laptops, but those didn't boot anyway because of a kernel bug not recognizing the drives in it.
In my experience quality only went down after Dapper Drake.
Anyway, when the next release comes out, I will definitely give it a try.
Hoping for the best.
The blue prints for the next release are nothing spectacular, so they might be aiming for some more stability on the next release. Even if it's not an LTS.
To the people being aggressive. Everyone has his own experience with each release. We have other hardware and other usage patterns. We have one thing in common, we want the future, now.
Ironically, Hardy was the most difficult to install (Live CD, burnt 2 times, was not booting up, used alternate) and the most disappoiting. Not even has it driver bugs (iwl3945 is wifi-blind 50% of the time) but i experienced, for the first time, a SLOW Ubuntu, slowest than my fresh-reinstalled XP. Astonishing.
For now, 7.10 is okay for me ^.^ and hoping the 8.10 will be at the quality level i was used to expect...
Hello Ploum,
Le problème à mon avis c'est que chez Ubuntu on utilise des applications instables, qui viennent tout juste de sortir. Ils ne se gênent même pas de mettre à disposition de leurs utilisateurs une version Beta de Firefox.
La stabilité, à mon avis, c'est plutôt chez Gentoo. Firefox 3 est toujours marqué comme instable, et ils ont sans doute raison :
www.gentoo-portage.com/ww...
Chaque distribution doit choisir entre un système instable mais parfaitement à jour ou un système stable mais dont les logiciels commencent à vieillir. Tout est donc question de bon compromis, d'une balance équilibrée.
La seule chose qui m'étonne, c'est qu'on expérimente les nouveaux logiciels sur des utilisateurs novices de Linux, plutôt que sur des confirmés, Gentooistes par exemple.
Quand à moi je préfère de loin la stabilité et la sécurité à l'innovation, dont on peut très bien se passer quelques mois.
Bonjour !
Je dois dire que je suis vraiment étonné de voir qu'autant de gens ont autant de problèmes avec Hardy car je trouve que personnellement j'en ai beaucoup moins que j'en avais avec Gutsy... Pour moi Hardy est bien mieux fini que Gutsy mais peut-être que j'ai la chance d'avoir du matériel qui marche sans problème avec Hardy... En tout cas je compati ! Bon courage pour la suite !
i'm using ubuntu hardy since the beginning (in 8.04), and if sometimes firefox crashes on some sites (with flash.. strange.. no?? :-) ), but for the other applications, i have no troubles!! My wifi & ethernet is still working with no problem: i'm only using wiCD instead of the network manager!!! It works better like this! @home and @ work. so.. i'm a bit surprise of all the problems you have with your ubuntu!! but, as i have learn with computers... wich is ok for me, is not for the others...
I left Ubuntu to install Debian and now everything is working fine ...
There was a time when Network Manager worked for WEP? I had no idea. It has *always* rejected my WEP keys. Network Admin (System -> Admin -> Networking) accepts the WEP key just fine, but it doesn't automatically dhclient. So if you use WEP, command line is the way to go. At least Network Manager makes WPA easy though. Back in Dapper Network Admin couldn't do WPA at all, that's why I started using Network Manager to begin with.
I'm using 64bit Hardy on one computer and 32bit on the other. Swfdec needs to be upgraded in Hardy to a version that works on 64bit sound drivers. Other than that & my response below...no regressions for me.
@ Gnark Sombre:
Yeah, iwl3945 is pretty crappy right now. It's the first version of the all-open 3945 driver. Hopefully it'll improve in the next release to a version that can see all the networks iwl4965 and bcm43xx can see and to being able to MAC spoof.
Above I said my evolution didn't crash. Since then it crashed 6 times in the last few days.
Sucks my balls off.
Tout d'accord.
I generally try to be bleeding edge (as in quickly upgrading to 'stable' Ubuntu releases), because I like to run new apps (as in FF 3, for instance). Hardy, though, is a major disappointment, and the first upgrade (I've had a couple) of Ubuntu that makes me regret it. It feels slower, Firefox feels slower, Sound simply is broken (including that I have to switch users(!) and turn up the sound *there* so that the sound for *my* user will reach a decent volume), Skype does not work correctly anymore (sometimes it will, sometimes I don't hear a thing), which is pissing off my girlfriend, and yes, FF crashes every day, and Epiphany much more often than that.
I can't believe that this mess is not only considered a stable Ubuntu release, but an *LTS* one. 7.04 was decent, 7.10 was really really good, but 8.04 seems to be a major failure (especially of Ubuntu's management or whoever is responsible for releasing it as is, and for including half-baked software like Pulseaudio).
Tiens, une mise à jour du kernel, une autre de firefox et j'en passe...
Est-on en droit d'espérer ?
What is say is all too true.
Ubuntu was working perfectly well until Gutsy. From there, it started going downhill. The user experience began to decline considerably. Graphics card crashes, Firefox crashes, package management issues and whatnot. Hardy is even worse than Gutsy in the crashes problem. I've actually reverted back to using XP. I can't believe how, once set up, everything just works perfectly - and I was surprised the most.
I also feel the pain, in fact, I've given up. I've accepted the facts. I tried very hard, but I'm sick of it. Ubuntu does not work, and is the best of all Linux distributions. Sadfully, that's not saying much.
I don't like Microsoft, and really enjoy the free software model, but I cannot use a system that doesn't work. Back to Windows for me it seems.
Mauvaise distrib.. changer distrib !
I've been using it for a few weeks and I haven't had any issues at all. Someone posted that if you used Wubi and update regularly then you can't boot into it, but I haven't had that issue at all.
After nearly two years I finally threw in the towel with Ubuntu 6.06 -- I was fed up with the wireless drop-outs and Nautilus not seeing Samba shares (unless Nautilus was run as root) -- and installed PCLinuxOS. With PCLinuxOS I get rock-solid wireless and everything, absolutely everything, works perfectly. It also uses the Synaptic GUI package manager, and it is a piece of cake to update all packages. If Ubuntu is giving you problems, give PCLinuxOS a try, you may find it works better.
Nonsense. Windows was too complicated so you switched them to Ubuntu. That is idiotic.
(si ça intéresse quelqu'un, je peux booter sur le nouveau kernel maintenant, ouf)
(par contre la gravure, toujours pas, je pête un cd à chaque fois, joie et bonne humeur)
Not sure about 8.04 but recently installed 8.04.1 and it is the best. Everything works, wireless, tracker (very good), firefox, all multimedia, fonts etc. No wireless drop outs for me. I use an Edimax EW-7318USg wireless USB adapter. Maybe it is just me but 6.10 Edgy version was also trouble-free for me as well.
Sorry to hear peoples trouble, but you have to know it's not the same for everyone. Ubuntu must push linux forward and sometimes mistakes and poor judgement happen. If you cannot fix your problems in 8.04 I hope you come back to Ubuntu for the next version. Constant distro hopping is making linux stagnate.
I'm aware that many people are disappointed in Gutsy, but I run 8.04 on two different rigs, and the few problems I experienced in the begining were solved within weeks by automatic updates...
@ Ploum : Evolution? Come on! It has always sucked, so nothing new here. I think time has run from email UAs and organizers, so I use webapps instead (Gmail, Google calender, etc.)
@ thatGuy : I don't think it's idiotic. Ubuntu (with Gnome) is more n00b-friendly than Windows, as long as the user doesn't need to fiddle with the config, that is :)
'Gutsy': Doh! I meant Hardy, of course!
I'm using Linux Mint Elyssa 5, which is based on Hardy, and finding it works okay. I wonder if it's because they seem to be committed to fixing stuff quickly. But I haven't used some of the network aps mentioned, or Evolution.
p.s. A further thought. I think Canonical is absolutely nuts to commit to releasing on a fixed schedule. Not even M$ has been able to meet its target dates, with all its resources. The inevitable result IS buggy software. The Linux distros that release "when it's ready" tend to be much more stable, PCLinuxOS being a good example. But I left PCLOS for Mint because the PCLOS community is so small. Maybe I was wrong - but Mint is working pretty well for the apps I need. Thanks for the warnings about Evolution, to Gmail...
Je rentre de vacances.
Je suis encore sous "Gutsy".
Je crois que je vais attendre un peut pour faire la mise à jour !
Salut,
Moi aussi je regrette mon passage à la 8.04.
Pleins de bug, Firefox qui plante lors de téléchargements, bug dans le gtkdialog de gimp, j'ai même du compiler le dernier alsa stable pour pourvoir utiliser mon micro avec mon ati sb600.
Et je ne parle même du temps de boot, même vista démarre plus vite.
Enfin tout ça pour dire que si il ne font pas un énorme effort avec la 8.10, j'envisagerais de retourner à Debian voir Gentoo.
I have just switched to Linux from XP, using Hardy, and it took me a couple of days to get things working. Now reading this I wonder if I should have chosen to stay one release behind the curve.
I still get crashes and strange Firefox behavior. In fact, Firefox as I type this is grayed out and won't come back to wake-state. I also have some problems with my wifi, though I finally got it to work by removing the security key and letting my wifi be unsecure.
How difficult is it to go backwards to Gutsy? Anyone tried to do it? Mine is a dual-boot XP/Hardy system.
Maybe you should use Windows. The sound works. So does instant messaging.
if you want fast, easy to use and stable linux - choose Pardus 2008. It is 10 times better than ubuntu.
Hardy is working perfectly on 4 of my computers (completely different hardware), most people I see having problems are using backports or third party Deb files.
Anyway works fine for me, sad for you but Debian is not the answer, you want stable go Slackware.
> Debian is not the answer,
> you want stable go Slackware.
ROFL.
You could just as well say "go VMS".
PS: my answer is ALT Linux but then again, it works for *me*, it's hard to generalize.
I agree completely. Since I'm under Hardy, I make a collection of problems. Evolution doesn't close (except when I turn off the computer), Firefox disappear frequently without any particular reason, the screen freezes sometimes during a few seconds, it's not possible to plug a mic on the computer, the net conection is sometimes unstable. Awfull. I've already reinstalled the computer, thing i've never done before since i'm a linux user. Conclusion : i've planned to install Debian.
You'r right, after migrating Gutsy towards Hardy I was in face of a lot of problems (unbelievable). Fortunately I had done this migration on a test environment (as usual). My first reaction was exactly as yours I was realy desapointed.
I corrected all these problems one by one and I am in production with Hardy only since end of July. Now I manage an infrastructure of 7 PC's under Ubuntu Hardy without any problem (I run Thunderbird in place of Evolution). The Ubuntu team worked very hard and we received an impressive number of update. What is clear is that Hardy was not sufficiently tested and was launched 3 monthes too early (Firefox 3 beta in a LTS!!). Some bugs still exists but are not detrimental.
I hope that Intrepide will be more better tested.
Don't wait until October, jump to Fedora now. No pulseaudio problems, NM-applet just working, Evolution is perfectly stab^W, err no Evolution is still bloated.
Fedora communauty is nice too you know ;)
I've learned my lesson with 7.04.
Debian testing for desktop and stable for servers. Ubuntu is a piece of crap, it's an insult for debian deveopers to call this shit a "dabian-based distro"
Sadly, this post finish as a troll with everybody pushing is favorite distro....
I just want to say thanks to Ploum for this nice article that, for once, do not praise Ubuntu ;-)
I do wonder why Ubuntu made so many drastic improvement on a stable release because i do have a lot of problem I did'nt have with gutsy (pulseaudio, automatic configuration: xorg.conf empty, Firefox3 ...).
But I also do wonder if it is not only because for once I did'nt start with a clean profile, i just upgraded... maybe that was the mistake. So I'll wait for Intrepid and start with a clean profile
As for other Distro why not, but I like the *user* centric approaches of Ubuntu and I like Debian based one. Speaking of Taste and color, I hate the brownish theme of ubuntu...
I share your pain with hardy. Network manager not being able to save my wep key drives me nuts. I reported the bug (bugs.edge.launchpad.net/u... but nobody seems to care.